There you go again, connecting Israelis to mean all jews.
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“Destroying Israel is okay, but ethnic cleansing is bad”
“WOW you think just because we don’t LOVE Israel we’re antisemitic”
Yes, you broke the code. /s
Oh is Israel being destroyed right now?
No, what does that have to do with this?
Is calling for genocide okay up until the moment it happens?
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Ah I see we have several new (well, new to this convo anyway) hasbara techniques employed here.
We have the classic crybullying
desperately pretending to be the victim here, of an obvious upcoming genocide of Israel! today! oh my!!
an attempt at distracting from an indefensible point you just made and cant think of a way to defend
and leveraging of the holocaust as a tool to push zionist colonialism and murder.
You have no one here fooled. And no, we are not going to change the subject to whatever fantasy you’d prefer. You dont get to control what we talk about when you get caught lying. You conflated zionism with all jews. No one did that but you. Its wrong and its ghoulish. Zionism doesnt represent all jews and if you had even a shred of integrity you’d take your post down.-
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Ah I see we have several new (well, new to this convo anyway, right) hasbara techniques employed here. We have the classic crybullying, desperately pretending to be the victim, an attempt at distracting from an indefensible point you just made and cant think of a way to defend, and leveraging of the holocaust as a tool to push zionist colonialism and murder.
What
… this has no connection to this conversation. Or reality, for that matter.
You have fun talking to yourself, buddy.
And the hasbara propoganda pushing loser departs shamed.
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This thread is going so “it’s bad to call for the genocide of israel” i had to re-read the meme.
It says “expell israelis to europe”… it doesn’t say “kill’em all”, wtf is wrong with this thread? Or am i missing something?And no, a one state solution is not possible, as shown after over 70 years. Unless that state was to be ruled and controlled by the UN and all other military forces completely dismantled - so, not gonna happen.
It would be slightly less unrealistic if the UN was to enforce the Green Line, ensuring the West Bank and Gaza are entirely in control of Palestinians.Both fail 'cos the UN has no teeth.
Full embargo on israel, especially on weapons, could work, but, again, hypocrites of this world won’t let it happen.
I have never, ever heard of someone calling for the deportation of Israelis. I think anyone who wants that was probably anti-semitic already and has taken the objectively horrific actions of the IDF as a reason to hate Jewish people in general.
I have never, ever heard of someone calling for the deportation of Israelis.
Calling for their in-place deaths is not a lot better. You have heard that one several times, right?
This is the innate issue with creating an ethno-state, it makes it difficult to delineate grievances between ethnicity and state. I don’t know what the solution is, but I find it understandable that some people would agree with expulsion.
Is it really ethnic cleansing when the ethno-state they built continues to genocide their neighbors with the approval of the vast majority of its citizens?
By that logic that birth in Israel gives the right to stay there, this would in turn mean that this birth revokes the right to compensation for the ancestors that were murdered in the Holocaust or survived it and chose not to go back to Germany.
I don’t think anyone should have to be kicked out of the place they were born. How do you feel about german babies born in poland during ww2? Or YTs holding all the land in south africa?
If you read the first comment I made I said it wasn’t my belief but I understand why Palestinians would want Israelis to migrate back to Europe… However, I recognize that it’s not my people who are suffering from apartheid and genocide, and that those people have their own autonomy and will seek their own retribution.
Israelis chanting death to entire ethnicities but nooooo we can’t say anything that might hurt their poor lil feelings. Bunch of bollocks.
Should European-Americans all “just relocate” since we occupied North America from the Native Americans?
Otherwise I don’t see how you’re any different than the Israelites.
Well one happened in living memory and people are still living in the houses of displaced people in Palestine.
Zionism is similarly a genocidal fascist ideology. If these colonizers can’t handle freedom, democracy, equality, etc., then they should definitely return to their actual homes.
Idk, any Israeli citizen currently living there (that wasn’t born there) is a first generation colonizer, surely it’s not anti-semetic to call for that specific subgroup’s relocation, no?
The “GO BACK TO EUROPE, THE LAND OF YOUR ANCESTORS”, “Israelis are committing ethnic cleansing by their existence”, and “Genocide is Okay, Actually, if it’s in response to another genocide” are widespread in this very fucking thread.
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I understand why Palestinians would want Israelis to migrate back to Europe
Antiyanks still can’t read or use a computer competently, news at 11.
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“Hey, remember that it’s okay to fervently oppose the current genocide and even the very existence of Israel, but don’t fall into racism or insane blut und boden calls for ethnic cleansing”
“OH so you want to make the genociders the VICTIMS now??”
10/10
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You realize that you put the comments in your own post right? So we can read them, then read your summarization of them, and realize how stupid you are.
Sorry that you feel the need to simp for genocide apologia?
I didn’t see any
If I said “It’s not my belief, but I understand why Israelis think all Palestinians should be killed or expelled. Israelis have their own autonomy, and deserve to make their own decisions on the matter”, would you:
A. Call it genocidal
B. Call it genocide apologism
C. Call it asspatting genocidal sentiment
D. Think it’s a completely normal and wholesome sentiment to express
?
If your answer is anything except D, take a fucking step back and ask yourself why you find genocide support okay for Bad Ethnicity™ but not for Good Ethnicity™.
If your answer is D, go home and rethink your whole fucking life.
None of the comments you posted said they understood why every israeli should be killed.
“We don’t want them killed, we’re just going to kill them if they don’t leave, it’s totally not genocide” is literally why the term ethnic cleansing came about and why it’s regarded as genocidal, for fuck’s sake.
Any other “We just really want them to leave” genocides you’d like to bootlick for? Maybe the Armenian genocide, or the genocides during the Yugoslav Wars? Or maybe the early stages of the Nazi genocide, when expelling the Jews was the main plan? Hell, maybe you’d like to swap sides on the ongoing Palestinian genocide? After all, the Israelis ‘only’ want the Palestinians out of Palestine!
There’s no undo button here. You can’t ungenocide by genocide, you can’t ungay a gay and you can’t unvote Trump. We can move only forward
As long as:
Stolen land is given back, and criminals prosecuted,
Sure.
So I, a jew who has never even been to Israel, who’s ancestors left centuries ago, am responsible for the state of Israel in any fucking way?
Jewish does not mean Israeli… At all.
So I, as a jew, who has never even been to Israel, don’t feel threatened by the original comment at all, because I’m not an Israeli settler and haven’t kicked anyone off their property, and thus don’t have to fear having to give anyone their stolen property back.
Ummm I never said that.
I agree that Jewish does not mean Israeli.
I’m specifically talking about individuals involved in war crimes that they should be held accountable.
Anti semitic remarks are not the same as anti Israeli remarks
I feel nothing when that guy changed “death, death to the IDF”. Well, maybe a mix of amusement and concern. But I have nothing, at all, to do with the IDF and do not support what they do
When you say, in this context, “I’ll cool it with the anti semitic comments when war criminals are brought to justice”, how do you think that feels?
Don’t take this shit casually, anti semitism goes back to biblical times. I’ve experienced it growing up. And now, they’re asking new York Jews what they think of “their” prime minister? They’re “othering” us already
They just built a concentration camp. In America. The Holocaust wasn’t the first time they targeted the Jews as the enemy within. I’ve always reminded my family who start flirting with conservatism… We’re always second. When they run out of people that look different, we’re next
I know what you meant. But that’s not what you said, and words matter
I’m onboard with that, man. Like I said, I’m down with everything up to the very destruction of the Israeli state. It’s just ethnic cleansing and antisemitism I’m opposed to.
Why not destroy the state and create one where everyone has equal rights? A state anchored in the supremacy of one group is an apartheid state. It’s clear as day which side you’re on supporting such a state.
Why not destroy the state and create one where everyone has equal rights?
That’s literally what a one-state solution is, as supported in the very fucking title. Jesus Christ.
A state anchored in the supremacy of one group is an apartheid state. It’s clear as day which side you’re on supporting such a state.
Me: “Like I said, I’m down with everything up to the very destruction of the Israeli state.”
You: “It’s clear that you support the state of Israel!”
The worst part is, I don’t know if this is trolling. I legitimately believe that you could be at this reading level.
There will be no Israeli state in a world where everyone has equal rights. It will be destroyed if it is for everyone to have equal rights. And a new state will be founded, under a name that is not Israel and doesn’t resemble the apartheid state of Israel. Only then can you actually talk about equal rights for every group of people.
… okay? How does that contradict anything I said, considering that I explicitly mentioned the destruction of the Israeli state as perfectly fine by me?
Or are you going to ignore that and make another inane statement in direct contradiction to the very comment you’re quoting?
With climate change picking up the pace in the last few years, not sure how much longer this area will even be inhabitable.
Imagine if nature does what humankind could not - ends the whole miserable crisis.
Bold to claim climate change has anything to do with nature. It’s just another, indirect genocide by the boards of all the corporations.
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Israel is the most anti-Jewish state since Nazi Germany, and Palestinians are semitic.
Fuck Israel, genocidal scum!
I mean sure. Don’t me a racist bigot. Of course.
But let’s not pretend that religion isn’t fueling the atrocities being committed on both sides of the conflict.
Jews, Muslims, and Christians lived in that area together for hundreds of years. This is a political conflict. The fucking Israeli settlers are psychopaths who roll into towns and start setting things on fire. It’s about territory, like all colonialist aggression.
Just gonna leave this here…
Religion does have a nonzero influence, but you’re correct in that this is primarily a political conflict. Zionists murder Muslim and Christian Palestinians alike, and Fatah, a secular resistance movement, was the leading org of the Palestinian side for the longest time.
Okay, so by “Zionists” are you referring exclusively to members of the Israeli government or might there perhaps be a broader ideology at play here? The meme reeks of a Bernie Sanders-esqe “Netanyahu is the problem” kind of narrative.
I don’t care where they go, just leave the fucking indigenous people alone.
Okay, so by “Zionists” are you referring exclusively to members of the Israeli government or might there perhaps be a broader ideology at play here?
There’s a broader ideology at play here that is very deeply engrained in Israeli society.
The meme reeks of a Bernie Sanders-esqe “Netanyahu is the problem” kind of narrative.
Sanders is a politician, not a polisci professor. Politicians say what they think will get them closer to the solutions they think they can achieve, not necessarily what is objectively correct. “We need to get rid of the worst of the genociders who has sparked the current wave of genocide, and condemning 70% of Israeli society, however correctly, will not give us the allies we need to reduce the current stage of the genocide and move to the next step of a just and lasting peace” kind of thinking - Sanders has long been a radical, by US standards, voice in support of the Palestinian cause. Thinking that him focusing on the most immediate enemy is condemnation worthy is blinkered at best.
I don’t care where they go, just leave the fucking indigenous people alone.
… do you care if Israelis in Israeli-majority areas recognized by international law as part of the state of Israel remain in Israel, where many of them were born and raised?
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Lol the npc is strong with this one.
Religion isn’t fueling it, it is just used as moral justification from both sides. If religion didn’t exist the same thing would happen, but with a different form of moral justification.
I think you’re wrong about religion. You’re trying to say that religion is used as justification afterwards, but we know that real numbers of religious nuts will endorse horrible things because of their religious beliefs.
In other words, would there be less violence occurring in that region if nobody had any religious beliefs? I think the answer has to be “probably yes”. We know this by talking to people, by looking at religious zealots throughout history. But even if our logic is correct, we cannot accurately guess how much less violence would be occurring if the region were full of atheists.
And in some sense our counterfactual thought experiment doesn’t even matter because the reality is that region is of great religious significance and you can’t really write that off as being irrelevant when several millennia prove that it is.
Also statistically countries with larger populations of atheists are significantly less violent.
Of course correlation doesn’t equal causation and it could be other environmental factors contributing to that nonviolence but nevertheless…
It’s a ton of racism too. Darker skinned Jews get all sorts of discrimination, it’s just not as extreme as someone who is Palestinian.
This is what I said and then someone blew up in my face about it when I said this in another thread/post. Why are people so hard headed when it comes to accepting reality I wonder.
Reality is an inconvenient Truth.
If it wasn’t religion it would be race or ideology or language or eye color. You could press a button and eliminate religion from history and all of these problems would still exist.
Unfortunately, the term “antisemitic” no longer has any kind of fixed meaning. I wish that weren’t true, and I think it’s a combination of forces that decided to misuse the word for several decades, that have now led to it being meaningless.
And you might be tempted to tell me what you think it means, and maybe I could agree with you, but when I turn on the TV tomorrow someone else will be using it in a totally different way that’s inconsistent. Actually I’m kidding. I don’t have a TV.
Words that people misuse are still meaningful when the reader and writer both understand the same meaning. I expect you understand OP perfectly well.
Words that people misuse for the sake of propaganda are intentionally misleading, regardless of how any in-group understands it.
Your use of the word “intentionally” is quite confusing to me. Intentionally misleading on whose part? The word’s part, or the in-group’s?
Jewish people and groups around the world need to issue strong rejection of Israel’s actions.
If they don’t, i’m very concerned that Israel’s crimes will fall back on them in the future.
Let’s look at sentiment from different groups
Young and liberal associate them with Israeli genocide.
Young and conservative is full of full on Nazis.
Politically they aren’t worth much being concentrated in liberal strongholds.
When the old folks who are pro Israel go into the grounds dislike will be a rare point of agreement. Not a great position.
Condemnation of Israel’s actions won’t protect Jews around the world.
Do you think it’s safer to support genocide?
It will protect them from the free palestine crowd, but not from anti-semites. Is there a downside though?
The free palestine crowd contains and covers for antisemites among their ranks.
I’m sure contains, though I doubt there’s a complete overlap, not covers for. People who want a literal genocide to end aren’t automatically antisemites or antisemite apologists. Nor are antisemites, especially Trumper antisemites, automatically in favor of Palestine.
Well yeah, obviously. There are anti-semites everywhere. I meant those whose motivations are “free palestine,” which in my estimate is the main motivation of the free palestine crowd when viewed as a whole – not antisemitism. I don’t mean to say that there don’t exist people who are aligned with free-palestine just because they’re anti-semitic. But there’s no protection from those people either way – so, no downside.
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